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OMG! Cherokees were in Quebec in 1649!

OMG!  Cherokees were in Quebec in 1649!


Andrew Hardin, a dedicated People of One Fire subscriber, sent us a link this afternoon to a Dutch map, which was updated several times between 1649 and 1670 . . . the last version reflecting the capture of New Amsterdam by the British in 1664.  The map that he referenced seemed to put the Cherokees in Quebec during the mid-1600s.  To be certain, I dropped what I was doing and studied several Canadian anthropological websites.  By golly, this has to be them!  French maps confirmed that this branch of the Hurons was pushed southward out of Quebec in the 1660s by their arch-enemies, the Iroquois Confederacy. 


Here is what the Canadian sources state:

The Cherioquet were a division of the Hurons.  The Huron’s autonym was ‘Wendat’, but the French primarily called them ‘Huron’ or ‘Huron les bon Iroquois’.  Champlain first referred to them as the ‘Ochateguin’, then later as the ‘Charioquois, Charioquet and Charoqui.  The English called them the Charokay, Charikey or Charakey. They were also known as the Allegonantes or Alleghenies. The Allegheny Mountains in West Virginia were named after them.  They resettled in southern West Virginia, southeastern Kentucky and and the southwestern tip of Virginia, where they were labeled on maps by their Mohawk name – Tionontatecaga.   

De L’Isle placed the name Cheraqui at the same location where on his previous map he had written Tionontatecaga!

How about them thar apples?



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Richard Thornton is a professional architect, city planner, author and museum exhibit designer-builder. He is today considered one of the nation’s leading experts on the Southeastern Indians. However, that was not always the case. While at Georgia Tech Richard was the first winner of the Barrett Fellowship, which enabled him to study Mesoamerican architecture and culture in Mexico under the auspices of the Institutio Nacional de Antropoligia e Historia. Dr. Roman Piňa-Chan, the famous archaeologist and director of the Museo Nacional de Antropologia, was his fellowship coordinator. For decades afterward, he lectured at universities and professional societies around the Southeast on Mesoamerican architecture, while knowing very little about his own Creek heritage. Then he was hired to carry out projects for the Muscogee-Creek Nation in Oklahoma. The rest is history. Richard is the Tribal Historic Preservation Officer for the KVWETV (Coweta) Creek Tribe and a member of the Perdido Bay Creek Tribe. In 2009 he was the architect for Oklahoma’s Trail of Tears Memorial at Council Oak Park in Tulsa. He is the president of the Apalache Foundation, which is sponsoring research into the advanced indigenous societies of the Lower Southeast.



    WOW! Now that makes perfect sense.


      I know only a little about native American history, but my grandchildren are supposedly descended on their father’s side from a Chief Walk-in-Water. The family’s last name is Waters and we traced their family tree to Indian land in North Georgia. They family say they are Blackfeet, but I thought the Blackfeet were from the Dakotas? Then, long story short, I did some research and found that not only was Chief Walk-in-Water of the the Wyandot, but that these also traveled down to Georgia and become founders (in part) of the Cherokee nation. Is this correct? Is it possible that the old family stories in their father’s family of descent from Chief Walk-in-Water are true? Is this first cursory research of mine viable? If so, what is the connection with Blackfeet? I am also aware that in Florida and Georgia, “Blackfeet” sometimes referred to Native Americans who mixed with African slaves. Can someone lead me in a correct direction for further research? I want to get this in order for them for posterity.


    “The Huron’s autonym was ‘Wendat’”.
    Do you suspect any connection between ‘Wendat’ and Wyandot of what would become northern Ohio territory and listed ‘Wyandot’ on Ohio maps a little later on? There is still an Ohio county called Wyandot. Interestingly, I am of paternal and maternally different regions of the US. My mother is from generations of Ohioans who mostly arrived in the state early on from Ny State, NJ, Pennsylvania, Indiana and one branch at MI and Illinois leading to one generation at Oklahoma and then back to Ohio circa very late 1800’s/1900’s and we know that though neither of my parents had family in the same areas at the same time, both show a Native component within their dna admixture; both share common Native descended cousins. My father’s family comes from the SE states and Appalachian region up until a generation ago, we knew he was Cherokee. My mother seems to have living Cherokee, Shawnee, and Indigenous Canadian Mingo cousins… Please message me sometime if you’d like to look at some interesting DNA results. Seems we have cousins from Florida/Alabama “Creeks” to NC and OK Cherokee to those who claim descent from Cornstalk. I was born and raised in the Ohio River Valley. I am told I look very phenotypically “Native”, but my dna suggests much more adnixed Ancestry- not surprisingly, I suppose, due to having no recent immigrant lines. I show North African, Sephardic and Ashkenazi Jewish, and quite a large previously unexpected percentage of Spanish admixture in addition to Western and Northern European Influence. My father’s line seemed to largely network with extended cousIn relationships to escape the removal; his side left Western NC and resided remotely/hidden in the Appalachian mountains of NE TN and SE Ky- the latter is said to be an area of former inter-tribal hunting land and a point of convergence of some remnant Uchee, Cherokee, and Shawnee. Anyway, have always wondered how Ancestry DNA could determine some 5th cousin range assumed relation between the geographically distant and distinct lineages of my parents. Many Native cousins appear to tie to both sides. My mother had a family tradition of some possible Canadian connection, to one of our Ohio lines; perhaps this could offer one possible route to the cousinship. Interesting article, thank you!

    • Supposedly, Wyandot and Wendat are the same name, but it is not that simple. The best I could understand from the Canadian websites was this: Between the impact of diseases introduced by the French and the devastating attacks by the Iroquois during the Beaver Wars, the indigenous population of Lower Canada and the Midwestern United States collapsed. The remnants either fled to other regions or else joined up with other tribes. So while many of the surviving fled to other regions and reformed new tribes, other remnant tribes joined with the core Wendats and remained in the Great Lakes Region . . . but much farther away from the Iroquois.

      Your North African, Sephardic and Ashkenazi Jewish ancestry means that you are either descended from the Sephardic gold miners, who poured into the Georgia Gold Belt in the 1600s or else from a Sephardic trader, who married a Native American gal. The Cherokees captured thousands of Native American slaves in the late 1600s, until the other tribes formed alliances and obtained firearms. It was quite common for the Cherokees to keep the most desirable teenage females as concubines or wives. Thus the DNA from many other tribes entered their heritage. You can send the DNA report to . Thanks!


        Thanks Richard, I’ll get an email together and send. I’m relatively knowledgeable about where most of the Sephardic and Ashkenazi plays in actually; a fairly large Spanish element was a bit surpsiring a couple years back- before I learned more about who actually populated the now US territory during the early Colonial Era… We average 10-15% Iberian Peninsula with hundreds of years of no known immigration event and certainly no acknowledged Spanish or Latin ancestor- which makes that part fairly obvious in it being a generationally inherited element and across a region of many similarly descended families who converged into an “other” ethnic claim w/ some assimilation or opting into alternative cultural ties. As for ‘Cherokee’ concubines, or what I refer to as ‘honorary wives’, that is still happening- make no mistake, people just don’t speak of it because it makes folks very uncomfortable on all sides.


    The Cherokee influence extended far into the north. This is little known. What happened was that these northern groups were cut off from the bulk of the Cherokees in the Southern Appalachia region quite early after the arrival of the post-Columbus Europeans. These northern groups did not fight against the encroachment of the Europeans, They just faded further back into the mountains. Eventually the Europeans just ignored them. So these groups did not get the attention in the history books, because there were no big battles to record.

    Here is a link to a book about the Cherokees of Virginia and Pennsylvania.


    Real history is fun history! Along with you, and many fans of POOF, I find that the earliest primary source documents, like this very early map, provide the most illuminating revelations into an authentic knowledge of history. Bit, by bit, we’re getting there! As can be seen, here, in the earliest citation I’ve yet seen, there is only the one, distinct, isolated reference to any people whose name can be construed to be “Cherokee”. Thanks for publishing this, Richard, and thanks, always, for your continued work.

    • And thank you sir! I don’t possibly have the time to scan all the information on everything. Producing articles and videos is very time consuming. I appreciate the help that all you folks are giving me!


    From [Canadian Museum of History Website]
    “A Prelude to Change –
    The Arrival of Europeans
    The ancient history of the Ottawa Valley ends with the arrival of Europeans, who recorded the way of life of the local Native people. In 1613, when Champlain first travelled on the Ottawa River, he met Algonquin bands and recorded their names: Quenongebin, Oüescariny, Kinouchepirini, Kichesipirini, Otaguottouemin, Matou-oüescariny and Charioquet. However, archaeologists are not sure if those people left behind the artifacts found at late Woodland Period sites. More research is required.”


    We understood that the Hurons vacated Ontario and joined their French missionaries in retreating back into Quebec. Problem is that the Huron population in quebec is too small. even with intermarriage. Going south allowed them to sidestep the Iroquois to land that could actually support them. They were corn growers and that is difficult in Quebec and limited to small river bottoms.


    one more comment. it makes sense for the french to shift their indian allies into Georgia were they were even contesting ownership as well. When quebec fell it made sense for those allies to rename themselves as a new tribe to the english who would know no better. Thus their sudden emergence.


    Richard, you know that both the Cherokees and the Muskogee’s main tribes arrived in Georgia in the Early 17th Century. Perhaps both supported by the French with Horses and muskets? Both Nations were involved in incorporations of other bands of people in their Nations and selling slaves as stated by William Bartram who spoke with the Native Elders. Could those people in Canada be “some” of the Cherokees… maybe?… but the Delaware (“Grand Mother Nation”) lore indicated that the Cherokees lived by them for a long time in Kentucky and in what was called the Allegany mountains. The French were clearly involved in the history of Georgia for the 17th century. The Dutch and Spain had been involved starting in the 15th century. I far as I am concerned, Sea merchant people have been trading with the people of this area of the Earth for thousands of years. Thank you for your articles.

    • All divisions of the Creek Confederacy were in situ, when De Soto came through in 1540. I can translate all the words, his chroniclers recorded while in the Carolinas and Georgia with either a Muskogee or Itza Maya dictionary. However, the Creeks were pushed steadily westward by British Colonial Expansion.


        Richard, William Bartram wrote these words about the Muskogee Nation (Creeks):

        “AND, if we are to give credit to the account the Creeks give of themselves, this place is remarkable for being the first town or settlement, when they sat down (as they term it) or established themselves, after their emigration from the west, beyond the Missisippi, their original native country. On this long journey they suffered great and innumerable difficulties, encountering and vanquishing numerous and valiant tribes of Indians, who opposed and retarded their march. Having crossed the river, still pushing eastward, they were obliged to make a stand, and fortify themselves in this place, as their only remaining hope, being to the last degree persecuted and weakened by their surrounding foes. Having formed for themselves this retreat, and driven off the inhabitants by degrees, they recovered their spirits, and again faced their enemies, when they came off victorious in a memorable and decisive battle. They afterwards gradually subdued their surrounding enemies, strengthening themselves by taking into confederacy the vanquished tribes.”
        The Cherokee Nation seems to have been formed in the same manner in the 17th century, who were most likely trading with the Dutch, the French living mostly by the Western side of the Appalachian mountains. (“Chalaque” on this 16th Century French map)

        • Mark, what Bartram and that generation of Creeks didn’t understand was that they were composed of many ethnic groups. The generation of Creeks, who presented the Migration Legends to the leaders in Savannah in 1735, understood that fact. The members of the Confederacy had multiple origins. In fact, the main core, which was Apalache, said that they came by boat from across the ocean to the south.


            Richard, you noticed the word “Mucoso” (Mvskogee)? in North Western Florida on the French map. This is the second map that I have noticed that tribe name at that location. Is It possible the Muskogee confederation began there before the Yamasee war… tribes that combined that moved West away from the Spanish and English then supported by the French with horses /muskets who became the Muscogee Nation. The French wanted Georgia’s Gold that the Dutch and Spanish were mining and supported both the Cherokees and the Muscogee’s advances into Georgia in the early 17th century. Of course the Cherokees would have incorporated some towns of Jews, Armenians, Dutch, Spanish that were living in Northern Georgia into their nation. “deserted Cherokee? towns noted on one map”
            The Native lore of many Nations arriving by boats of course is true… long ago.


    I think I have heard some of what you’re saying Mark, I know non-Cherokee cousins who are connected to some of the other tribes and the story they like to remind me of is that Cherokee allied themselves British when British had lost favor and largely become enemies to many of the other tribes from the Catawba-Cheraws (supposedly) to the Mvskogee who as Richard mentuined, had been pushed a bit outward by that point. I’m hesitant to admit this as it seems Mvskogee is the winner in this blog for fanfare 😉 but my Cherokee paternal lineage is related to almost all of them- and my grandfather died when I was too young to ask for details, but he definitely claimed his Cherokee as well as his Creek/Mvskogee descent among other things. He also used a reference to being partially “Black Dutch”, I don’t have the Creek ties that survived to make me feel as Creek connected, whereas a matriarchal affinity to the Cherokee aspect was much better preserved. If I knew which lines are my tie-ins I might feel as biased as some folks are sounding in occasional comments on this otherwise fabulous blog. No offense Richard. I was actually reading up on some literature an anthropologist completed related to my Cherokee element, when a FB friend saw me confuse your name and this blog for a possible relation to the author of that book: Russell Thornton. He recommended I keep an open mind and shared some of his own dna contributory Creek heritage and info thereof which, apparently, was of interest to you, I’m open minded and just love to absorb FACTS wherever I come by those, very analytical if not a bit critical when considering new info, but enjoy the material so far. I have shared with Andrew Ayers Martin a few map finds and appreciate his love for those in kind; aooears a common appreciation here which is awesome. Have also passed along a piece of old material written by a Provincial Carolina Governor regarding which Indians he thwarted being abducted from just south of the territory (Ga or N. Fla), and though the Cherokee, Creek and Chickasaw of the remibal era no doubt participated in slavery, the referenced Slave raiders encountered in that early Provincial Carolina instance were actually a group of Yamassee Indians who had come across what the Governor referred to as a peculiar group of abducted Indians who spoke Spanish and professed Chrustianity as the Papists do, which led Mr. Provincial Carolina Governor to brag on his own accord of ethically determining no Christian Indians could be sold to the “usual customary place” of the Caribbean by the Yamasee. They were ordered to return these Spanish speaking Papist Indians of present day Ga or very Northern Fla to the Spanish governor or similar located at St. Augustine. Interestingly, he also cited a Jew was his interpreter and provided the information which formed the end decision made against selling the intended slaves. I am quite convinced the British persuaded the Yamassee of that early Provincial Carolina era to raid for Indian slaves of the interior regions to be sold for profit to the NE Colonies, Caribbean and who knows where from there- of course early Colonizers manipulated and shifted us around as much as possible- hard to enslave a man in his own backyard! I don’t see a lesser devil among them quite frankly. Each band and each Colonizing group at the elite level was capitalizing to the best interests of his own perspective and prosperity. The British made a crucial mistake of breaking too many promises and did well to make enemies of many of the tribes and bands, so well that my understanding to now was that a Cherokee-Canadian connection known thus far came with many of the men alllying themselves to the Loyalist/British army during the Revolution and a residual threat of being affiliated with the losing party of that war made Canada a safer option for those Natives who had backed the British, My dna shows Maya and Karitiana secondary similarity along with the Spanish and it all makes sense. The trouble for me is that it seems on the outside looking in to gauge where my lost Creek connection is, and hoping to connect, many seem to want to hold onto an us vs them attitude and I have just about had enough of folks forgetting to mention none of us are full bloods and many of us still share family lines across the various SE tribes at this point. Anyone who pretends the Cherokee are hardly of Native admixture and is too stubborn to admit their own admixture is quite similar by percentage similar to all the present SE DNA testing results & data limitations of the moment, I can’t pick a side and would love to learn more about the Mvskogee heritage so long as I can learn some stuff beyond the typical us vs them mentality of both present tribe’s living members. The fact is, eventually the Colonizers played us all and we figured it out late, but we figured that out. I know descendants of nearly each of the major known tribes and many pro,iment so called full bloods and direct descendants of chiefs even a generation above me, tribally enrolled, so proud, but I have seen their dna and many will never admit they are almost zero percent so called Native American by dna admixture designation to date. Andrew Ayers Martin is a lovely and refreshing example of an honest Creek descendant who just craves each new discovery as it’s revealed across all the lines.., staying tuned. Thanks for allowing me to follow your discoveries Richard. Gratefully, Cassie

    • Hey Cassie
      Delighted to have you participating in our discussions!

      Actually, I am not even Muskogee. My closest kin would be the Miccosukkee and Hitchiti-speaking Creeks in Florida. In fact, the majority of Georgia Creeks were not Muskogees. Until the late 1780s, the majority of people in Georgia spoke Itsate (Hitchiti). English was second, Muskogee was third, German and Cherokee were tied, until thousands more Cherokees moved south after the Chickamauga War ended. Until I was in my early 20s, (based on family stories) I thought that the Muskogees were the enemies of the Creeks. It is only recently that understand what was going on back then. Most of the Itsate Creeks and Uchees sided with the Patriots. My gggg-grandfather was a scout for the Patriot troops in Georgia and South Carolina. A mixed-blood Tory, Alexander McGillivray, made himself Principal Chief and moved the Creek Capital to Pensacola in British West Florida. That was a long, long way from where the original Creek lands were. He began launching attacks with Upper Creeks against pro-Patriot Creek and Uchee towns in eastern Georgia. So my Creek ancestors ended up fighting Upper Creeks along side their white neighbors. At that point most of the Creeks and Uchees in in eastern Georgia and South Carolina cut their ties permanently with the Creek Confederacy. One of our subscribers, who has no known native ancestry, even found a document that put his family and my family fighting Upper Creeks from inside a fort in Wilkes County, GA. LOL Much of our research in POOF is merely to correct misconceptions students read in textbooks about the past.


      Cassie , i am a Muscogee , Yuchi , Cherokee , Choctaw, Lumbee/ Cheraw descendant, just as much as i am English , Scottish , Irish , Swiss Jew , Frisian and German descendant…..except the native side is a lot harder to prove , as my ancestors came to South Alabama/ Northwest Florida before the Trail of Tears. And , as you have stated , my Cherokee Lantern family might just be Cheraw , Hillabee , Pee Dee , Jewish , Spanish , Dutch or one of the many groups roaming around the north georgia / northeastern south carolina mountains in the late 1600s. I claim Yuchi because one of my ancestors was born in Holmes County , Florida in 1850 , just north of Euchee Anna , Florida , in area full of people known as ” dominickers” , and packed up and left when a known dominicker named Allen Mayo took a bunch of people west to Rapides Parish , Louisiana and became part of the people there still known as the original ” Redbones “.


        Hey Matt,
        I am an administrator over at Family Tree DNA; some of your family names and references sound familiar- have you uploaded some dna from living family members of those lines for comparison over on GEDmatch? If not, it might be worth consideration… I have encountered a couple of folks with connections to AL and the FL Panhandle proximal areas who mentioned a few similar ideas… it is possible to isolate shared dna segments and gave families some clues as to which cousins and family line(s) warrant focus with genealogical searches when identifying Native ancestoe(s) was of importance to them…

        Overall, I have sometimes seen some Dutch/German etc. with some South Asian/East Indies and other heritage elements come in where Native indicators might have been expected, a phenomenon which has even provided a bit of surprise to families of a few prominent lines which traced back to the SE from around the Revolutionary War era… Even some known Chiefs‘ descendants find their families to have some similarity in the dna to some formerly unexpected population(s).

        Have a little familiarity with Mayo/May. Very interesting, I have encountered a particular line that migrated into Louisiana and went into Rapides..if memory serves correctly, they also had a connection– either Alabama or Georgia…

        Some rich history going back many generations for our SE Natives, and I use much of my private time/personal efforts in hope of collaborating with others interested in getting the truth down for the record, and for posterity.


          My grandmother is a Mayo , who married a Ray. Her grandfathers mother was a Lantern from Gwinnet county , Georgia. I am also researching Gibson and Fields. One of those Rays , was a 13 year old living by himself in Indian Territory in 1813 on the upper Coosa river. Can you imagine being a young teen living by yourself ?



    I am thinking that 1649 was a very eventful year in the history of New France. Perhaps it may also have been for the Cherokees.

    On Champlain’s 1615 journey up the Ottawa River he was led to a 30,000 strong algonquin speaking nation on the south shore of Georgian Bay. The French had deemed these were a ‘civilized’ people because they were employing large scale agricultural practices and so decided to make this area the focus of their settlement and religious conversion efforts. The Fort of Sainte Marie was built in 1639 but was raised by fire in 1649 upon the approach of a large Iroquois war party. Those who were not killed were scattered… some went back with the Jesuits to Quebec while many starved to death on Christian (AKA Skull) Island in the bay. Many were taken in by neighboring tribes like the Neutrals who were also later defeated by the Iroquois.

    I was initially looking into the possibility that these survivors may have been sent south to protect the western Appalachian frontiers (trade passes) of New France in the late 1600’s during Lasalle’s forays but that didn’t happen. My guess, considering the 14 algonquin mutually unintelligible dialects that the early Cherokee were reported to have spoken, is that it was an amalgamation of the remnant of many nations that were forced out of Ontario just after 1650.

    Neutrals here…

    Fort Sainte Marie here…

    LaSalles wanderings…–volume1_tonty_la_salle_files/lasalle-exploration-map.jpg

    Don’t forget that a good number of the French Jesuits were Jewish converts. The Spanish Jesuits were almost entirely composed of Jewish ‘converts’ from the beginning of the creation of the Order.

    • I didn’t know that the Jesuits had many Jewish converts. Interesting. Some of the 14 bands were not Algonquian. The Chiska, who were to become the Bird Clan, were Panoans from Peru. All of the Lower “Cherokee” Towns in South Carolina were Creeks. I have no trouble translating Lower Cherokee words, even though Cherokee scholars say that it is a dead, untranslatable language. They were Itsate Creeks. There was also at least one band, who were Jewish. Adair described them in his book.


    Could this be why the “Rickohocken’s” disappeared from the West Side of the Appalachian Mountains? They became part of the Cherokees thus the reason they were also such big time Slave Traders?

    Also, in 1649 the Mohawks sent the Seneca against the Erie Indians along northern Ohio and Lake Erie. They eventually wiped them out or absorbed them by 1681. Into this hole in the early to middle 1700’s is when the Shawnee aka Savanno’s came to the Ohio Valley. Lots of movement occured throughout this time for various Tribes all over the North and Northeast.

    • Yes! I think the same Mohawk Invasion split off the Cherokees from the main body of Hurons . . . who were forced to flee westward to what is now Lake Huron.

      If you recall, late 17th century maps used the Mohawk name for the Cheroqui, when they moved to southern West Virginia.


    1492 was also a big year for many reasons. The expulsion of practicing Jews from Spain led indirectly to the establishment of the Order of the Society of Jesus 40 years later. It may have also provided the impetus behind the migration of Jews to the New World in search of religious freedom and of course riches.

    Timing as they say is everything…

    ” On August 3, 1492, just three days after the deadline given to Spain’s large and vibrant Jewish community to convert to Christianity or leave the country for ever, three ships – the Niña, Pinta, and Santa Maria – set sail from the port in Palos de la Frontera West.”

    The powerful dynasty of the Medici bankers owned the Vatican back in those days. Although Christians were prohibited from engaging in the practice of usury, somehow the Florentine banker ‘converts’ were exempted. but where they actually true converts?

    These 16th century painting of Cosimo Medici (and others) reveals the family roots. Look closely at the hand sign displaying their secret roots. There is nothing remotely controversial with respect to the meaning of these hand signs.

    Then on to some 16th century Medici portraits…

    Cosimo Medici

    Maria Medici…

    The House of Medici…

    And some interesting portraits of other occulted power personalities over the years…

    I just LOVE Pope Ratzinger btw lol!


    This explains many things and makes good sense!

    Thanks, again!


    Very interesting

    So atleast part of the Cherokee migration legend is true. The core came from the north via the great lakes region. Now is there any proof on the Cherokee migration starting in the southwest through the plains into the great lakes region?

    Should researchers/sholars consider the name Cherokee to be a given non-native name perhaps a corruption of the word ‘sharqi’ meaning ‘oriental’/’easterner’ (due to mixing with people from the Caucasus, Anatolia, Middle-East?) or is it a corruption of an actual native name?


      There is an origin story amongst the Mohawk about the Iroquois coming from the southwest. They lived next to the Hopi Indians whom they considered to be their cousins. Then at some point due to the inability of the land to support so many people the Iroquois began to wander towards the Great Plains and stopped where the Missouri and Mississippi Rivers meet. They were living with or near the Pawnee with whom they were allies. Again, after a few generations living near present day St. Louis they crossed the Mississippi and ended up in the Ohio Valley following the Ohio River northeast. During this time there was many split offs of several small bands who ventured north and became known as the Tobacco, Neutral, Huron, Petun, Wenro, and Erie Nations. Another group went southeast and became known as the Cherokees, while a large number settled in central Pennsylvania and were known as the Susquehannas or Conestoga Nation. Undettered by these divisions the main Iroquois Party continued on and while paddling up the Great Lakes and the St Lawrence River they were captured by the Alogonquins and spent many years laboring for people they called, “Adirondracks or bark eaters” because they had the habit of flavoring their food with shredded bark. After many years the Iroquois managed to escape and head back down river to Lake Ontario. They settled here and grew in number eventually the 5 divisions of the Iroquois Nation came into existence.
      This is a synopsis of what is written in the book Iroquois Culture and Commentary by Doug George Kanentiio pages 19-22. There are other books written by Iroquois descendants who tell the same origin story.


        Michelle C., Thank you for the info. Do you have any idea what the true origin is of the name/word Cherokee?
        Now there are atleast four candidates: 1. Iroquois (perhaps the letters ‘ch’ were added to differentiate the Iroquois nation who stayed in the Great Lake region and the Ch-iroquois who moved to the south); 2. Chiriqui (Panama); 3. Churukhi (Caucasus) 4. Sharqi (arabic word meaning ‘oriental’/’easterner’).


          I imagine someone here has studied some of oldest maps out by this point, so apologize in advance if I’m repeating known info: I wondered if anyone has studied an old Map c. 1566 outlining various ports and Indian villages? If so, I definitely see some interesting places which seem ruled out by the POOF community- Is the general consensus that there were no words used in naming villages south of present day Canada within maps around the 16th Century? I just want to double check myself that I’m on track here; I saw a couple of interesting towns, one to knock out of the way would be a [Canadian/NE] Village labeled, “Taina” just East of the Great Lakes and “Arcadia”; Next, a similarly named Indian Village much further due South ^Taino; Next it’s very clear there are two large expanses of Mountain Passes which would represent the Allegheny expanse and below this, another large Mountain range which goes from roughly TN/GA to NC mountains of today… labeled near Ohio “Appalchen”, labeled just below this, “Civola Hora” [does that mean Gold Here, Qualla Town Here something like this?? Still working to translate and brush up some place names], but anyway, just below Civola Hora is clearly labeled “Canagadi [Canada] Coruc”, perhaps, Canadian Carok [Indonesian word that sounds identical to Cheroke minus one E]… Now back up to just North of the NE ”Taina” Indian Village, there are the other two towns which share some similarity with the commonly known word “Tsalagi” of more present times: Indian Village 1. “o chelaga”, Indian Village 2. “Ochelai”. The mapmaker has a Latin influenced name, which is important- if he was Southern European and spoke Spanish, and likely was hearing the territories names by some orator, the Spanish spellings can have phoenetiv variance from the French, of course- they pronounce the v, b, s, r, and other characters would produce different sounds when coming from an English speaking person- unless one alters pronunciations a bit… I am still working at looking this map over… Perhaps I ought to brush up on some of the posts here this evening as well. Hope to get caught up with the latest ideas here…

          • Hey Cassie,

            Most maps in the 1500s and early 1600s contained Latinized place names, so they have to be translated into English or whatever. When this map was drawn, European geographers thought that the Great Lakes were the Arctic Ocean, which connected the Atlantic and the Pacific. The region had not been explored any further than the vicinity of Montreal. In the south, no one had gotten any farther north than western North Carolina and eastern Tennessee, so the geographers thought that the southern Appalachian Mountains were much closer to the “Arctic Ocean.” Apalache is the plural of Apalache in the Panoan languages of Peru and Georgia. At that time, the Kingdom of Apalache stretched from SW Virginia to SW Georgia.

            The word, you thought was Canagadi is Canasagua – Hispanized version of the Muskogee-Creek word, Kanasaki, which means “Descendants of Kanos People.” Canos is below that word.

            Civola Nora is the Italianized version of Cipola North . . . which were the Proto-Creek towns between present day Atlanta and Columbus. Cipola South was a province in SE Alabama and the Florida Panhandle, where the Cipola River now flows.

          • Cassiehall0017@gmail.Com'


            Rare map of North America first published by Paolo Forlani in 1565, the first separately published map of North America.

            “This is the first map of North America and the first map to show the Straits of Anian.

            Paolo Forlani’s rare and finely engraved map of North America is one of the most significant early maps of America. It is the earliest printed map devoted solely to North America, the first to portray that landmass as a separate continent and the first to show the so-called Strait of Anian separating America from Asia at the approximate location of the Bering Strait.”

          • It is the same map,just printed the year before. The Latin phrase at the top reads “Unknown Northern Sea.”



    FYI… Homann (1716) shows the Charioquet in the same location just north of Montreal as the Dutch map @1670.

    If the Mohawks in fact called the Cherokee by the name “Tionontatecaga”, and if this word is a derivation of the word “Tionontati”, then by extension the Cherokees may be the Petun or the Tobacco Nation that was displaced from their home on southern Georgian Bay along with the Hurons and Neutrals by the Iroquois around 1650. Perhaps some Petun traveled back to Hochelaga with the Jesuits. Since the word means people of or beyond the mountain however caution is advised lol!

    “The Tabacco people, Tobacco nation,[1] the Petun, or Tionontati in their Iroquoian language, were a historical First Nations band government closely related to the Huron Confederacy (Wendat).” (Wikipedia below)

    Ancient Cherokee Map…

    Petuns… do they look like the Cherokee?

    • My understanding of the Canadian anthropological texts was that tribes with the same name as pre-Beaver Wars tribes were often not really the same people because so many bands went wandering across the countryside in search of refuge then rebanded together. There is no doubt though that where Guillaume De L’Isle put the Tionananticaga in 1701-1707, the labeled Charoqui in 1717.

      Holman may have been copying an old map and didn’t know that the Cherioquet had moved elsewhere. According to Canadian texts, French immigrants took over much of the Cherioquet land.


        No mistake. You’ve got them.

        Buy yourself some asbestos underwear and some quality Kevlar outerwear.

        Things are going to be getting hot for you.

        Email to?

        • That warning is to someone who was given three days notice to be evicted on Christmas Eve 2009, then spent the next year in the national forests. Our email address is:


    Reminds me of this guy: “Mohawk Chief Tionaga”
    “Too often, Native Americans during the Revolutionary War period are portrayed as savages. In this ca. 1740 print, Tiyonaga, later named King Hendrick by the English, is portrayed in a much different light. He is shown wearing ornate European clothing, including a shirt, a gold-trimmed coat and waistcoat, and a cocked hat. He holds an ax in his right hand and what appears to be a wampum belt in his left hand. Other notable features include a facial scar on his left cheek and a tattoo on his left temple.”
    “Many years earlier, in 1710, Tiyonaga had been one of four Mohawk leaders to travel to England for an audience with Queen Anne. It was during this visit that he was dubbed “King Hendrick ” and his portrait was painted by court painter John Verelst. The Verelst portrait of the youthful Tiyonaga was later engraved by John Simon and produced as a print titled “Tee Yee Neen Ho Ga Row, Emperour of the Six Nations.”

    Here is a link to his photo and the article, zoom in and notice his weapon of choice… and distinct facial scarring… article aside, I notice something I’ll continue on post-link…

    I am Cherokee… ONE element I match dna-wise is about 5.35 percent genetic similarity out of my total genome to certain descendants of old world South Asians… if we’re looking at linguistic commonalities, it’s interesting there is a group of Madura “East Indians” who employ the use of an Indonesian word: “Carok” (Chair-oak is how google translate pronounces it, spot on phoenetic similarity to our Cheroke[minus an e] lol. Anyway, Carok has a verrry interesting meaning, “The term of carok means “fight with honor”. Madurese dialect described it with ‘ecacca erok- orok’ meaning “to slaughter and to mutilate”. Ancient Javanese (Kawi) defined carok as fighting. Please look at this weapon on google, and have google translate say “Carok” in Indonesian for you.. A prominent Carok fightThe term2 of carok among Madurese means “fight with honor”. Madurese dialect described it with ‘ecacca erok- orok’ meaning “to slaughter and to mutilate”. Ancient Javanese (Kawi) defined carok as fighter has the same facial scarring or very similar markings at both sides of his mouth area to the left part of the face on the above linked Tiyonaga portrait/scar shown… Perhaps someone who made it to the East Indies saw similar weaponry or fighting among some of the Northern Indigenous men? Stretching here, but who all made it on those early ships where these early maps were drawn up dating to mid 17th century? Clearly before Tionaga the Mohawks time, but did a potential Dutch VOC ‘matroos’ from the Dutch Madura East Indies Trading Post potentially Spot a tomahawk or even a crop sheathing scythe or sickle and use the Indonesian word for some weapon he identified with being similar- potentially threatened even? Or let’s look at these Southeast Asian peoples of that time and their descendants… I see Malay and Dayak tribes of Indonesian Borneo, “Sarawak” of Malaysia…How related were the Iroquois, the Algonquin groups, the “Cherokee” the “Mohawk” who intermixed with them very early on, or even in ancient times? I’m curious. Then we have a group called Seraw near present day Ohio and the Catawba-Cheraw who certainly carry a degree of Dutch to the present day as pertains to total admixture… you’ll also find “Sarawak” (bit similar to “Arawak”) when examining the East Indies Territory via map.



      You will find Petun/Huron/Neutral and perhaps even Erie ancestry. That would be the Cherokee core. Wyandot is considered specifically Huron Petun up here in Canada but the mix gets larger when the Erie are added.

      Love your posts and great work by Andrew too. Good stuff coming up.


        Hello Nwb,

        Nice to “meet you” 🙂 What’s your name? I’ll take all the info folks are willing to share, thank you! I thought you were Richard until just now lol, sorry about that!


          Sorry for the late response Cassie… my name is Edward and I am 0% native but 100% fascinated and living in Ontario Canada.

          The Jesuit records of the peoples they encountered (before they destroyed them) is incredibly detailed and intact. There will certainly be written accounts of les ‘Charioquet’ on that 1654 map. I will be reading through some this week so I guess that 3 year stint in Montreal wasn’t wasted time after all lol!

          So far they appear to be an assortment of 120-150 mixed Petun-Huron (our Wyandot) and Ottawa who ran from the Iroquois in 1649 to Green Bay but came back to Montreal in 1654 to restart trade to the interior. The location shown on the map is on Ile Jesus (Laval) where the Jesuits, coureur des bois, and explorers set up shop back in 1637.


          BTW… Tionontatecaga is the Iroquois word for the the Petun who lived in Huronia on the south shore of Georgian Bay. The Huron called them Tionontati or “those who live on or over the mountain”. That was the location of the Petun relative to the Huron relative to Blue mountain.

          They were also called the “cave people”… perhaps because some may have lived in caves on Blue Mountain in Huronia?

          • That’s interesting because the Petun were also the “civilized” mound builders of the northern Shenandoah Valley. Most people don’t know that until the late 1800s, there were many mounds in the Valley. Petun is the Tupi (South America) word for tobacco.


            Hello Richard and Edward, always a pleasure to read and catch up on both of your insights… still the newbie around here, really appreciate the patience while I’m absorbing all of the amazing observations.

            First, what a stunning image of the lake Edward. Incredible!!!

            Ok, hopefully without getting too left field and ridiculous here, I recently read over what appeared to be some sort of mystic-shamanistic web index of old Quechua root words-

            Let me preface my Quechua notes with the following; Somewhere here at POOF, albeit a bit of time ago now, believe I read a fascinating linguistic insight Richard made within an article focused on Cherokee tribe. Believe that article noted some potential Anatolian connection in word etymology for a name Cherokee people have used, “Ani-yun-wayi”.

            The Quechua web page gave an etymological breakdown I found strikingly similar (non-expert viewpoint)
            1.) Ani- quite similar to Quechuan root word ‘Anti’ which translated to different uses, probably clearer to the native speaker but I will do my best: “Andes” as in, of the Andean region…but more ancient and literally suggested by the shaman/Inca word-guide to mean “(facing) toward the rising sun”
            2.) yun- “people” (possibly directive to a dark pigmentation as this root word is used to name the respected black jaguar (feared and viewed with reverent respect by the Native ‘Andean’ jungle dwelling group). *I read further notes that discerning the usage of the root word is, of course, subject to special understanding of the specific culture, but I imagine also, whoever their ancestors would be (perhaps a combination of Tungusic Siberian language families affects one or more indigenous language families in the Americas, Turkic-asiatic indigenous languages of the East- could be at least one key influencer, if R.T. was on to something quite genius with his former observations)
            3.) Wari- (denoting) “The Ancient Incan Kingdom”

            Incan Quechua is said to include a base of 13 important sounds. The core words are added as required to support subject and context. Many letters achieve similar sounds and are interchangeably used.

            Thus, according to these notes, “Anti–yun–Wari/wayi could be translated something like, “A people of the ancient Incan Kingdom, toward the rising sun”.

            There were some usage of one of the above root words for other interesting items of note, however, including a reference to an old serf subjected population within the old Incan Kingdom, of some lowly status or another group of some potential historical foreign element i.e. an obscure/unknown nature and/or distinctively obscured in phentotype i.e. possessed a dark distinctive physical trait of some kind, skin tone perhaps
            OR something more religious in nature: usage of the same ‘yun’ dark/obscure root word employed on the jaguar, was also said to be employed in reference to some old-world priestly group. In another reference, the priestly group fell out of favor and was banished at some point…

            These word and cultural references I’ve noted were suggested to be analyzed within the framework of a pre-conquistador centric cultural appreciation of the Incan People and Quechua language.

            Does anyone know whether Algonquin languages potentially fit a Quechua etymological model? I wish to take a closer look at some of the likely Indigenous designations from that same 1566 Map of North America, curious if any had some potential Quechua etymological similarity.

            Apppreciate any thoughts, as always. My poor brain needs to catch up with the ideas in some of the latest POOFS- gratefully challenged in following your shadows…


          • Hey Cassie

            Look at the Southern Arawak and Panoan dictionaries from Peru. Bother peoples were definitely in NE Tennessee and SW Virginia. For example, the Bird Clan is called the Chisqua in Cherokee. Bird People in several Peruvian languages is Chiska – Koa. Ani means Principal. I bet Aniyvwiya means “Principal People.”


            Thanks Richard, that’s funny. That’s exactly what I was taught, lol.
            I read an article and it seemed there was some other meaning- this Panoan word you use, what areas and groups, exactly, are you referring to when you use that… Maybe that will help me get less confused, at least on POOF ☺️. I know you’re busy, but when you get a sec it’s appreciated. Q: Is Pañoan an umbrella term in your mind, and if so, what people …thanks!

          • You have no clue how busy I am. It’s a little secret right now.

            Chiska, Shipibo, Conabo, Cashibo . . . any South American tribe, whose name ends with a bo. Interestingly enough, bo has the same meaning in the Panoan languages as it did in Archaic Anglish, Swedish and Danish . . . but still can be seen in many town names in Sweden and Denmark. The original name of the Holston River was Shipi-Sippi, which means Fish River in Panoan.


    Richard T., Could there be a similar situation as the Florida Apalachee and the Georgia Apalache? If so; could it mean there were infact two non-related tribes or perhaps even a colony ;mixed with natives; of Caucasian, Anatolian, Middle-Eastern people who either adopted or were given the name Cherokee derived from a source population / tribe who are infact the Chiriquí (Cheriqué) from Panama?
    Are there any known DNA samples of the Chiriquí of Panama which could be used to identify any Chiriquí DNA markers (if there even is such a thing) in the native population in Southeast and perhaps even Northeast America? If there were/are pre-Columbian natives from Peru, Mexico and even Scandinavia (Saami) living in Southeastern America there could also be natives from Panama living in the Southeast.



    Don’t think we are referring to the same map, wasn’t aloud to comment in reply to your response, must be a site glitch… here is the map:

    Rare map of North America first published by Paolo Forlani in 1565, the first separately published map of North America.

    This is the first map of North America and the first map to show the Straits of Anian.

    Paolo Forlani’s rare and finely engraved map of North America is one of the most significant early maps of America. It is the earliest printed map devoted solely to North America, the first to portray that landmass as a separate continent and the first to show the so-called Strait of Anian separating America from Asia at the approximate location of the Bering Strait.


    Richard and POOF community,

    The “Charioquet, Charioquois,” referenced on map and in Champlain’s own words, were an assembly of Huron & Petun (Wyandot, Wendat) and Algonquin natives. There can be absolutely no doubt of this. Whether or not the original regime ancien french word “Charrier”, meaning “carrier”, may be open to interpretatation, but the recorded usage of this word peaks in the early 1700’s. As for Ile Jesus, or Laval as we know it today, it was where both the Jesuits and the ‘Charioquet’ resided at the time the map was produced.

    Verb Table
    1. [alluvions, nuages] to carry along
    2. [marchandises] to cart

    The suffix “quet(e)” means a “collection” (of?)
    The suffix “ois” however certainly defines a nationality or a people in old french

    It may just be a coincidence that these words imply a name based on the occupation of these Algonquin/Wendat peoples that Champlain used to explore the land. What can not be disputed is that “Charioquet” was interchangable with the word “Huron” in all of his, and others, early writings. These were the ‘savages’ who carried the Jesuit priests, french traders and early explorers into the interior of the continent, including all rivers west of the Appalachians that drain into the Mississippi. If they encountered a similar speaking peoples in their journeys they may have been recorded as being “Charioquet” or “Cheroqui”.

    This is from Champlain’s written encounters…

    “On the thirteenth day of the month [16] two hundred Charioquois [17] savages, together with the captains Ochateguin, Iroquet, and Tregouaroti, brother of our savage, brought back my servant. [18] We were greatly
    pleased to see them. I went to meet them in a canoe with our savage. As they were approaching slowly and in order, our men prepared to salute them with a discharge of arquebuses, muskets, and small pieces.”

    You will note that his servant had lived with the Charioquet all winter long in Huronia in the following passage…

    ” I saw also my servant, who was dressed in the costume of the savages, who commended the treatment he had received from them. He informed me of all he had seen and learned during the winter, from the savages.”

    As to the location of where the Charioquet lived at the time (1614) … the writings are very clear. The archive of Jesuit records I will link in the next post. They describe the trip there in detail.

    From Chapter 3 below…

    “One of our young men also determined to go with these savages, who are
    Charioquois, living at a distance of some one hundred and fifty leagues
    from the fall. He went with the brother of Savignon, one of the captains,
    who promised me to show him all that could be seen. Bouyer’s man went with
    the above-mentioned Iroquet, an Algonquin, who lives some eighty leagues
    from the fall. Both went off well pleased and contented.”

    The Algonquin of which he speaks lived at Lake Nissiping which is just over 80 leagues from the falls at the Lake of Two Mountains near Montreal. I have read this story in several accounts. The distance from Huronia by waterways is almost precisely 150 leagues… a league being 3.5 miles. There is no mistake since the names of them peoples along the route the Charioquet took are all clearly recorded. The course they took was up the Ottawa River to Lake Nissiping, then down the French River to Georgian Bay, and then down the eastern coast of Georgian Bay to Huronia where the Huron tribes lived. The Petun, which he did not immediately visit, where located just to the west at Blue Mountain.

    The reason they took the long way there is that it was the only way to avoid the warring 5 Nations Iroquois.

    Also clearly indicated at page 290 here…

    Champlain’s voyages with illustrations here…


    Chalaqua, Chalaqui, Cha’racci, Cherokee, etc are all rooted in the French word Chouraqui. It meant “Easterner”. The French also called the Shawnee “Chalaqui” (the l being an r) on one map. It’s a generic word for tribes East of where the French were and may have ties to the Quechua Peruvian word for “jerky” which was Ch’arki: (first paragraph). Hard to say though because a similar word was used for Moroccan Sephardic Jews (Chriqui), a Germanic tribe (Cherusci), and Circassian woman (Cherkess). It’s all over the place. Everywhere except old maps from Tennessee in the 16th and 17th century. lol Back then folks were called Chiaha.

    Is there a way that I can navigate through your website and read old posts that are no longer on the main page? Either I’m a bit touched between the ears or once they’re off the main page they disappear into the ethers. haha


    If the Cherokees are also known as Charakay and Alleghenies wouldn’t that mean they’re actually Circassians who are also known as Cherkess, Karachay, and Adyghe?

    • Those are possibilities, but we really don’t know anything for certain. The only sure thing is that they were living in Quebec, east of Lake Erie in 1649.


    Isn’t it far more likely that the Cherokee were merely the Cheroaque on this map by the Spanish in 1578?

    Another Spanish map from 1597 shows the same people as Chalaqui:

    Then the group called Chalaque were depicted on this map from 1625 by the French:

    Here the Chalaque can be found once more on a French map in 1703:

    This official French map from 1718 by De’Lisle is the most detailed of them all and shows the entire region as Le Cheraqui with several southernmost towns. The small image that you posted from 1717 cuts out the southernmost towns.×640.jpg

    Going solely by maps there is no reason whatsoever to doubt that the people called Cherokee today were already in those mountains when Europeans showed up. There was, without a doubt, repeated mixing between various ethnic groups and races to such an extent that most modern Cherokee carry very few, if any, of those original Cherokee markers. But that is true of many places around the world where different groups mixed in.

    There’s certainly no reason to connect the Cherokee to the Huron in Quebec based very loosely on the similar linguistic sounding names. Something that seems odd is how self-identifying people are attempting to tell the “true” history of tribes that they do not actually belong to as citizens. How many of the people commenting are enrolled members of any actual tribal nation? I know asking that question might offend some folks but doesn’t it matter? Wouldn’t that be like being a German trying to tell “true” Polish history or a Russian telling the Chinese they don’t know their own history?

    If we apply the exact same logic you are using to connect the Hurons to the Cherokee then the Cherokee could just as easily be the Germanic tribe of Cherusci who defeated the Roman Empire. After all, they were a mountain people too. Or they could be the Cherkessian Adyghe people of the mountain region from the Black Sea down to Anatolia. Why not make them the Chiriqui Sephardic Jews of Morocco or place them as originating in the Greek fishing village of Charaki? Hell . . . the Cherokee could just as easily be the Charaku of Japan. The names are similar enough, right? Anything but a group of Natives living in those mountains since Mississippian times dating clear back to the Cactus Hill and Saltville sites in western Virginia 15,000-20,000 years ago and having roots in the Topper Site of South Carolina 50,000 years ago which they would share with all other southeastern people on some level. I’m beginning to think that Americans are so obsessed with conspiracy theories and alternative histories that the truth just isn’t exciting enough. Being able to discover “hidden truths” is fun, after all. I enjoy uncovering those little gems and nuggets others overlooked. But we can get easily carried away just as the Europeans did at any word that gold was discovered here or there. I think we often forget that we’re talking about real people when we speculate on the cultures of others and refuse to even consider what they have to say about themselves.

    There is no question that a great deal of nonsense has been taught about the Cherokee, by Cherokee and by Europeans who made up whatever they wanted and then taught it to Cherokee children. There are also some among the Cherokee who are not the least bit Cherokee (neither culturally nor ethnically). Then there are millions of Americans claiming they are descended from Cherokee who can’t actually substantiate their claims at all. From Ward Churchill to Elizabeth Warren. The lands of Northern Georgia are Creek lands. Of that there is no question at all and real Cherokee need to stop acting like those lands were once Cherokee lands. The only time they belonged to the Cherokee were very briefly from 1814-1838 when the Cherokee took them from the Red Sticks and President Madison granted it to the Cherokee. At no other time was any part of Northern Georgia part of the Cherokee traditional lands. Always have been and always will be. That’s why those who left the Mountains and have no interest in returning will cease to be Cherokee at all, if they haven’t already.

    Just my thoughts . . . In my own search for the truth over the years I’ve made a great deal of mistakes. That’s how we learn, I suppose. Through trial and error. Seeing these maps are you willing to admit that you might be wrong about the Cherokee? Just curious because history is full of men who were so certain that they knew the truth about various things that they attacked anybody and everybody who challenged their ideas. Not many of them ever came acknowledged they were wrong when shown that they were.

    • No, Chiliki is a generic term in Totonac, Itza Maya and Creek for a primitive tribe. There are several different spellings of that province in the De Soto Chronicles, but it is clear that they are using a word from their Muskogean guides, because this tribe wore rough skins and dug up roots to eat. There is a paper trail of the Cherokees migrating southward from the Lake Erie area through West Virginia to NE Tennessee during the late 1600s. All indigenous tribes in the Southeast except the Creeks use words meaning “cave dwellers” for the Cherokees. This tribe matches all the descriptions of the Guanahatabey People of extreme western Cuba. They had been pushed out of most of Cuba by the Arawaks.



    I stumbled upon a complete history of my local Great Lakes tribes. Its a fantastic read. I am still of the opinion that the 1650’s word “Charioquet” itself derives from ancient french loosely meaning of “Collection of carriers”. It was later clearly composed of the remnants of many tribes scattered to the winds by the Mohawks. This helps explain the many and often mutually unintelligible languages that they spoke. Unlike the heavy canoes made of elm wood that could not be easily portaged, the Huron and Ottawa (original Charioquet) used lightweight birch bark canoes which made for the fast and long distance travel required to get those inland furs to Montreal and the Jesuits into the interior.

    Below you will find an historic account that places the Cherokees south of the Ohio river in 1738. By then they had switched sides from the French to the British where they remained. Please scroll down to this time period since it’s a lengthy though well written article.

    You are looking for these paragraphs…

    “In 1738 Orontony (Nicholas), a Detroit Wyandot chief, refused to participate in a raid against the Cherokee (British allies) south of the Ohio River. Going well beyond this, Orontony also helped the Cherokee ambush a Detroit war party which earned him the lasting hatred of the Ottawa, Ojibwe, and other Wyandot near Detroit. The Wyandot came to the verge of civil war, but the clan mothers intervened to keep Wyandot from killing Wyandot. When the other Detroit Wyandot refused to allow the Ottawa to punish Orontony, the resulting quarrel ended a hundred years of close cooperation between them. Orontony and his followers left Detroit to establish a new village on the Lower Sandusky River in Ohio. By 1740 he was trading openly with the British and encouraging the Wyandot near Detroit to do likewise. With the outbreak of the King George’s War (1744-48), the Detroit Wyandot, Ojibwe, Ottawa, and Potawatomi sent their warriors east to help the French defend Montreal from an expected British invasion. However, the Sandusky Wyandot and Mingo remained neutral and stayed home.”


    “Meanwhile, Orontony strengthened his ties with the British. In 1745 he concluded a separate peace with the British-allied Cherokee and Chickasaw… ”


    And thanks again for all you do 🙂

    • And thank you for sending us such valuable information!


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